Transforming Divorce: A Path to Clarity, Compassion, and Empowerment
Discover expert insights on navigating divorce with clarity and compassion in this episode of Restorative Divorce. Join host Erin Birt and divorce financial professional Brenda Bridges as they explore strategies for building the right team, making informed financial decisions, and empowering yourself throughout the divorce process. Learn how to turn challenges into opportunities for growth and healing.
Listen to the podcast, here.
[00:02] Erin Birt: Welcome to Restorative Divorce, the podcast that's here to guide you through the challenging journey of divorce and co-parenting with clarity, compassion, and empowerment. I'm your host, Erin Birt, and I'm thrilled to be your companion on this transformative path. Divorce can be one of the most emotionally and logistically complex experiences in life. But here at restorative divorce, we believe in a different approach, one that prioritizes healing, understanding, and cooperation over conflict and contention. Throughout each episode, we'll dive deep into all things divorce and co-parenting related, offering you invaluable insights, practical strategies, and expert advice to help you navigate this terrain with confidence. From communication tips to legal guidance, and from coping mechanisms to co-parenting strategies. We've got you covered. So whether you're just beginning to contemplate divorce in the middle of the process or navigating life post-divorce, you're in the right place.
A Personal Journey to Divorce Expertise
[01:07] Erin Birt: Well, thanks for joining us today. I have a colleague of mine here, Brenda Bridges from Chattanooga, Tennessee. However, her experience and expertise apply to anybody going through a divorce or facing a divorce, or contemplating divorce. And so, Brenda, you're a divorce financial professional and an author. Maybe you could tell us a little bit more about what you do and your story.
[01:35] Brenda Bridges: So my story really landed me where I am. It's funny. So I always talked to my partner, I guess it was just last week, and he said something to the effect of, that's a very interesting career you've chosen. And I was like, well, it really chose me. You know, it's been a windy path and a way to get here. Yeah. But my story landed me in this work or this practice. And it goes like the way back beginning I was an executive in marketing and advertising, and then I left. I got my master's in education. I was going to teach, but then I had three children and it didn't make sense for me to teach while paying someone else to take care of my kids. I was still running my own marketing company during that time, and then I was really lucky to have the opportunity to stay home with my kids. It was kind of a family decision that we made where I would be the at home parent, my spouse would be the working outside of the home parent. And I did all the, you know, I was on the north side of Chicago, so not far from you, and did all the, you know, soccer mom and PTA and Girl scouts and all the things until my kids were in their teens. And then I became a yoga instructor because I love yoga. And it was like, what can I do now where I can still be flexible and around for them, but they just didn't need me as much. And I wanted to kind of move into my more empty nester happening, you know, in the offing life. And then my husband lost his job, by far the primary breadwinner, and he, he pretty much chose to not work for a while. And I was looking around going, well, I don't think yoga is really going to put my kids through college. There are no benefits to yoga. It's time for me, you know, I've been lucky. I've been at home and having all the quality time with them. It's time for me to step into something else. So I went from yoga to being a financial advisor, which made a lot of my friends go, what just happened there?
[04:08] Brenda Bridges: My advisor had been for a decade saying, you should do this, you should do this, because she would come to our meetings and I would have all my own spreadsheets out and be really into it. And I like financial planning. It was kind of a part of what I did in advertising, marketing, it was management. So I stepped into that, got my certifications and licenses, and embarked on that career. And about a year and a half later, truly how the story was unfolded, or did unfold was I was sitting at the kitchen table and I had all my stuff together. I was doing a little work before I left to work, and he came home from his Starbucks run and he pretends it's coffee, you know, he leaned up against the kitchen counter and said, well, I was going to write you a letter, but I figured I had to tell you in person that this just isn't working. I'm not going to do counseling because therapy doesn't work, and, you know, there's just no glue. Now go to work.
[05:14] Erin Birt: Oh, wow.
[05:15] Brenda Bridges: And I was not expecting, you know, in retrospect, I think those who were in my shoes look back and go, yeah, I should have known. But I really was surprised. Yeah. And that led me into this wild world of family law or divorce practice. We went through the process. It was about a year and a half, a little less. It was very expensive. It was a six-figure divorce. And then we ended up back in court. That was another five figures out of my pocket. So it was a very expensive undertaking. And in my perception, a lot of that was needless, like for, for what we decided. And we pretty much ended up almost where we started. It didn't make sense to me that it took so long. It costs so much, and we still don't speak. It's very cursory. And the worst part of that is for my kids. They're adults now, but this has impacted generations, and it still bubbles up because we're both their parents. We're going to have interactions forever as long as we're on this earth. So that led me to, well, how can we make this better? Pretty much, how can I help people not have the experience that I had and not make the mistakes that I made, which is key. Like, I didn't come through it. Like, oh, look at me, I'm doing divorce better than anyone else has ever done divorce before. I messed up royally. I made a lot of mistakes. There were a lot of mistakes made in our process. I started out with this kind of mantra of grace and dignity. This is how I want to walk through this. And that fell away, and I got all swept up in the drama of it, and just so many things went south. Yeah. So those things together led me to first become a certified divorce financial analyst. There was a big, fat mistake made in our settlement worth over a million dollars. In that case, it was a big one, and that happens all the time. The more I'm sure you see it, the more you're around it, the more you see things that could have been done better. And my goal was to just help people understand their decisions, help people get educated about their options, help people pick the thing best for them and then get the support in that that they need. Yeah. As I was doing the finances for a while, I realized, like, this is, in this case, kind of one sided, because I don't. I am not a believer in, oh, just, it's like a business arrangement. Think logically, you know, just put on your financial cap and figure out your divorce because it's really emotional. And I thought that that was lacking. So became a certified divorce coach and then a mediator, and I'm collaboratively certified, so I practice more in the helping people figure out their own best process, who they want their team to be, why they want their team to be those people, and kind of how they walk through divorce with more of the. How they want their life to be down the road in mind than being really, you know, I guess in that it's almost traumatic or shock-oriented state where it's like, what is the next thing I have to do? I don't understand what's going on, and it's all coming at me, and it's just so much that it becomes overwhelming.
[09:09] Erin Birt: Yeah, I love that.
[09:12] Brenda Bridges: That's my story.
[09:13] Erin Birt: Yeah. No, I love it. I love how you took your personal journey and moved it into a process that is better for others. You know, not only did you learn from the process, but now you have developed a better way for others to approach their process. So I love that. I love when people can understand. It's not just crunching numbers or pushing paper. There is an emotional aspect to it. You know, I get calls all of the time. I just want this done, or this is simple, or we have it all worked out, and I have to start talking about, it's a process. It's not just an outcome. Anybody can get you divorced. You know, you could go ahead and just do it yourself, but how can you do it better? How can you cross your t's, dot your I's, and that you later? Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely. So it sounds like, Brenda, you've gone from, you experienced maybe more of a traditional approach. Sounds like you went the court route, actually.
The Importance of Building the Right Team
[10:20] Brenda Bridges: It was a collaborative process.
[10:23] Erin Birt: Okay.
[10:24] Brenda Bridges: And it was a collaborative process that ended up being framed more with that litigation backdrop.
[10:31] Erin Birt: Okay.
[10:32] Brenda Bridges: And it's funny, like,
down here, there are only a couple of collaboratively trained attorneys, and I'll hear others say, oh, yeah, I can do collaborative. I can do collaborative, but it really is a specialty. And if you have folks saying, yeah, I can do collaborative, without a clear understanding of, it's a whole different language. It's goal based, it's not winning based. It's not this *** for tat negotiation. It's how are you both going to come out as intact as possible on the other side? That kind of thing. So I would say that while we did the collaborative process, there were definitely places in that process where it didn't feel very collaborative.
[11:16] Erin Birt: Yeah, yeah. And I think it's so important, and I know you and I communicated earlier about building the right team, and I think that's huge. Could you maybe elaborate on that? Maybe some tips or tools that you think are helpful for somebody to build the right team?
[11:37] Brenda Bridges: Yeah, absolutely. I think it's really important, and it's a really hard concept for people to grasp when they're hit with this, that the first thing you do is not build your team. In my opinion. The first thing you do is try to figure out what you want life to look like later. Do you ever want to speak to your spouse again? Do you want to, if you have children, sit in the same aisle and walk them down the aisle together at their wedding. Do you want to be together at graduation? Try to paint a picture in your head of what you want this to look like way down the road, not just in the moment.
[12:20] Erin Birt: So establishing their goals, perhaps their goals at the beginning. Yeah.
[12:25] Brenda Bridges: What is your purpose? And I've met people who are really clear. I never want to talk to them again. I am so hurt by them. They are clear. They're their goals, and they can evolve, but figure that part out first, and then that informs your next steps. So if your goals are to be collaborative, maybe you look into the collaborative process. If your goal is to, you know, you still can communicate really well. You have decided together not to be married anymore. Maybe mediation is a great answer for you, and you can really control what your decisions are. Maybe you need to litigate. There's a power imbalance or there's abuse or there's addiction, or, you know, there's some reason that you really need someone to be your advocate and talk for you. But figuring out your goals first, then figuring out your process, then, I believe, drives you to. Then you find the professionals who support those things. And I had a meeting yesterday with someone just kind of going through, walking through steps to take in actions and questions to ask your professionals when you're figuring out who you want to work with. And sometimes it's easiest to, like, point up mistakes, I'll have people come in midway through the process, and they're six months, eight months, twelve months into going through divorce and go, I'm just not comfortable with the people I'm working with. I don't feel they have my back. They don't explain things to me. They don't answer my phone calls and so on. And they're at this point where there's a lot at stake in a divorce, especially if you're in a long term marriage, if it is acrimonious and you're having trouble come to decisions. So you really, I think, want to work with someone you feel a bond with, you feel like they have your back. You feel like you're getting good guidance. So it's really important to do that at the beginning instead of, you know, I'll see it on social media all the time. My husband just told me he wants a divorce. I need the biggest ball boasting a journey, or I need that, you know, a heavy hitter. I need that mean as well. Do you? And maybe the answer is yes, but maybe the answer is you need someone who understands how to deal with high conflict personalities. You need someone who understands different needs of special needs children. You need someone who understands complexities of grade, divorce, whatever it might be. Really knowing where you stand is going to help you figure out who to work with and asking questions that are important to you about how you want to work. Some people want, you know, just answer me quickly. I don't need to have a long, drawn out conversation. I want it to be yes, no, do this next. Other people want to sit down and go through things and really have it explained and have long conversations about it. Neither is right or wrong, but you want to have someone who matches you. If you're a person who really needs, you know, held in the process, and you have a professional who is very, you know, direct, straightforward, doesn't support that, you're probably gonna be unsettled. And do you want to feel unsettled when you're making all of these really important decisions? Right? I don't think so. Yeah.
[15:57] Erin Birt: And it sounds like, you know that what you do with your clients and what you advocate is to know all of these nuances, or at least start identifying them so that they have some, perhaps empowerment or some better control over their process. Would you maybe expand upon that a little bit about how people can use understanding themselves better, understanding the process better, maybe identifying their team better, how that can all help the entire thing, but also that person's involvement in the process as well?
Financial Preparedness and Empowerment
[16:35] Brenda Bridges: I believe it puts people in a better headspace. And when you're in a better headspace, you're going to make better decisions. You're not going to be as agitated and scared, fearful, full of anxiety if you are in touch with what you need and meeting those needs. And it sounds very woo woo. And I can go that way. Remember I was teaching yoga before. I do think there needs to be a balance between the logical, financial, tactical, contractual part of divorce and the emotions and understanding and fear. There are a lot of people who are walking into this after 2030 years of marriage not knowing what's coming next. Well, if that's information you need, getting that information while you're going through the divorce and being able to look forward and how you're going to be impacted is really valuable. And often it's treated as divorce day done. You've proved up, a judge has blessed it. Goodbye. And then they're on their own to figure out what's next. And there's an awful lot to figure out when the divorce is over. So the more prepared people can be every step of the way, get their questions answered, and in a lot of ways. And I hear it from people and will also say it, they don't know what they don't know. Divorce is definitely one of those. Even if people have been through divorce before, it's going to be different this time. Their circumstances different, their spouse is different, the laws could be different. Their stage of life is likely different. It's gonna be different. So having a partner, professionals, and also personal support, who's gonna positively walk you through your options? Who is going to make sure you understand, not brush you off, say you're feeling bewildered about what's next, who is going to really be your coach? And, I mean, a mediator has to be a neutral party. We can't sit in the room and say, oh, you should do this, or that's a good deal. But we can bring understanding of the steps and the process to the process instead of, you know, I have seen occasions or heard of occasions where people will meet with the mediator and the mediator will be like, okay, what are we going to talk about? And they don't know because they don't.
[19:10] Erin Birt: Know what they don't know.
[19:10] Brenda Bridges: They don't know. They don't know what they need to decide. They don't know what's important. So the more we can bring that, I think, to people as professionals who have done this with other people and give them the info they need to make their own decisions, then the better off everyone's going to be. Because I'll sit in a mediation with people and we're talking about their parenting plans and bring up things that I've seen come back post-divorce and cause a lot of problems or land people in court again, and we can try to talk to them upfront, and often they'll say, we never even thought about that. How are we going to do that? And sometimes they say, that doesn't matter to us. It's not an issue. Whatever they say, it's their agreement, it's their roadmap, it's their journey for their family. So I think the more, and I hope I'm not getting off track with your question, I might be, the more we as professionals can bring to people information they need to make their own decisions, and as much as possible, keep it out of the court system. If it's not necessary, then I think the better off everyone is.
[20:30] Erin Birt: Yeah. And I know we've talked a lot about preparing for the process, but could you share any tips about the actual process, maybe any financial guidance or any preparatory tips that help for when they're actually starting off, when they're actually getting into maybe some of the nitty gritty or educating themselves. Right. Sometimes we have clients that one person did all of the finances and the other person managed the household, but maybe in a different way and isn't understanding the finances. But any tips on that? Now we're moving into the actual process. Any preparation there or any guidance there for people facing divorce?
[21:18] Brenda Bridges: I think the, so we often say, you know, you had your CFO person and your CEO person, so the person who is the chief financial officer, they took care of the money, and usually there's just one, and the CEO took care of the household, or however they divided things. Often the CEO person, the one who did not do the finances, has no comfort zone. There might be a lot of work around money, there might be shame and guilt around money, there might be the, oh, I should know this, but I don't. So I'm afraid to ask the question. The more people can try to set that aside or better yet, get help to work through why they're facing those issues around money. And there's no shame in it. We all have it. I've worked with millionaires who are like, I don't really understand this. Money has a lot of baggage, and money and family finances and family are the big decisions that you have to make in divorce. So with your finances, your attorney, or whomever you're working with in the process is going to outline for you the documents that you need to gather and why. And we're really looking at four things, right? We're looking at what you earn and what you owe, what you have. And I messed that up. We're looking at what you earn and what you spend, what you have and what you owe. That's the easiest way to put it. So if you don't understand any of those categories, if you don't know what you spend, then it's going to be in your best interest to figure that out. And you're not figuring it out based on your current situation. You're trying to future cast. You're trying to look at when I'm living in a household, separately, independently, what is it going to cost me to live with a decent standard of living? Just a little stagnant on that. What I see women often do is they will say, they will scrimp, they will pull back radically. So they're doing their expenses and maybe let's use little things. Maybe they got a manicure once a week, maybe they got their, you know, they went to a gym, they had a gym membership and saw a trainer, maybe they took a girls trip. They'll start scaling all of it back. Oh, I don't need that. I don't need that. I could do without that. I can bring that in. No, no. And then they'll do this budget or call it household expenses or household spending, and it won't accommodate the standard of living that they're used to. And then usually things get pared back even more as people are discussing and coming up with their settlement. So ideally, when you're doing it first passed, make it realistic for how you've lived your life.
[24:07] Erin Birt: Yeah.
[24:07] Brenda Bridges: And then if you start moving things around or taking things out, you're doing it knowingly and consciously rather than from the get go. Like, no, no, I'll just do without. And maybe ultimately you will do without, but maybe you don't have to. Don't start there. So that would be my. On what you spend, like words to the wise, start, start really where you are, or the equivalent of that, living independently. And then as you go through those different categories, if there are things that you don't understand, seek help. It's out there. You can find a CDFA. You can get resources from your attorney. If you're working with an attorney, say, I really do not grasp what we're talking about here. Like, what do you mean about my projected net worth? What does that mean? Well, your projected net worth is important because maybe you're looking at a settlement where you're going to get a million dollars and a million. Actually, this is a real story. I had a client come in, their case just settled last week, but they came in two years ago. She had just been in a mediation. In the mediation, the offer to her was $80,000. That was the offer. And her attorney went, this is not normal. But her attorney said, oh, good, you'll walk away with some money. She felt very uncomfortable, and she left the mediation. And then we started working together. $80,000 if you have 100 or $160,000 might be quite equitable. $80,000 if you have a million dollars is probably not. This was a long-term marriage over 20 years, probably not good. And she had no concept other than this just doesn't feel right. So we dug in and we started working on it. And we're looking at finances, and she's like, so I should get at least a half a million dollars. I'm set for life. Well, then when you just keep walking down the money path and looking at what her expenses were, the family expenses, but essentially what it would cost for her and the kids to live independently was over $100,000 a year.
[26:28] Erin Birt: Year. Yeah.
[26:29] Brenda Bridges: The 500,000 she was talking about was in a retirement account. So to access that, you have taxes and penalties. So it's not really 500. Let's generously call it 400. So if she's spending $100,000 a year and she's getting 400 that she can spend, that's liquid, she's good for about four years, and then it's gone. And walking through things like that, like the next logical stuff, with someone who can help you understand the ramifications, then she can make decisions like, oh, I thought I could just stay home and I would be set. I can't. I'm going to have to start a career. I'm going to have to find a job. I'm going to have to get new education because she hadn't worked in 20 years. Whatever the case is, then you're empowered to make good decisions. But the key is you find people around you who you don't feel like you can't speak about the things, you don't know, who you can ask questions, who will have the patience and really speak to you. We all have different learning styles, so in a way, that works for you. I'm an auditory learner, so I really like to sit down and talk through things with people. If that's not your style, if you have a professional who is talking at you, but you really need to read it, you might be better off with someone who's like, yeah, here's all the things, all the documents. You on your own time, with your own cup of coffee in the morning, can really dig in. So a long way of saying, find someone who matches how you process and who will take the time to meet your needs. And part of that is really getting honest with yourself and clear about what those needs are, you know?
[28:20] Erin Birt: Yeah, yeah. And it sounds like, Brenda, you really, you and your firm really help clients with that future vision, right. That it's not just, where are you at right now? You know, let's just get through this divorce, whatever it is, I'm just going to get through it. But it sounds like you are really focused on that. That future vision, and that really leaves your clients in a much better spot than, than when you found them, hopefully better.
[28:50] Brenda Bridges: And sometimes it's hard news, sometimes it's a big reality check like that, you know, I'm going to be set for life. No, you're going to be good for four years. That's hard news. But she's making better choices and decisions for herself, having that information.
[29:06] Erin Birt: Yeah. And being able to maximize that as best she can, knowing, okay, this is not going to have the longevity that I thought. And so many people I see go into this and they just went out of the process. Even if they decide what process might work best for them, there's always that feeling at some point, I just want this done. And they make poor decisions and then they continue to make poor decisions because now they might be resentful or they didn't understand or there was a lack of thoroughly going through or even sometimes a lack of letting the professionals you work with help you thoroughly get through things and they make those decisions and that just has a ripple effect. But if you focus on your goals, focus maybe even on your own shortcomings sometimes focus on the process, focus on building a good team and have that future vision of what does this mean, what are the consequences? And can I make better decisions or best decisions given the circumstances, then I think that sets everybody up for better success than had they just gone into it. Okay, I want a divorce. I'm going to file and then see what happens.
[30:19] Brenda Bridges: I'll figure it all out. I'll figure it out later.
[30:22] Erin Birt: Yeah, yeah.
[30:24] Brenda Bridges: And just like in a relationship, no one getting divorced doesn't have triggers. That was a lot of negatives. But, but there's space in every relationship where there are things that they're going to agitate you or maybe you find yourself in the, oh, he always does that. Here we go again. And the noise or the monkey mind is so loud and busy in your head that you can't rein it in and focus on the decisions at hand. And that's another thing that your professionals can be understanding of, like, oh, yeah, I saw that unfold. Obviously, there's some baggage there. And let's talk about what we really need to focus on and decide. Well, allowing and recognizing that instead of just disregarding it. Yeah.
[31:19] Erin Birt: Well, Brenda, as we wrap this up, what would you say is either a number one tip or something that somebody really should focus on when they are thinking or contemplating about having to go through this process?
[31:35] Brenda Bridges: I think making informed decisions is really important. If you feel like you don't know
what you're doing or if you feel like you don't have all the information you need, you probably don't. So it's out there. You might need to do a little work for it, but you can find it. Find it in professional support, find it in readings. This is going to be more than one thing I would be very cautious about going online or going to social media for your divorce advice. You don't know what the person giving that device has been through. Their situation might be parallel to yours. It might be totally different without having that perspective. Do you really want to take life-altering advice from someone you don't know? You don't have a relationship or by a public vote. You know, you got 42 comments and 39 of them said this. So I'd be really super cautious about getting guidance from social media. And then the last thing I would say, one step at a time. Yes, you want to be done. You want to be at the end. You want to be through with it. Of course, it is not a happy process. It's really difficult. But if you take it step by step and just focus on the next thing with clarity while keeping your goals in mind, your outcome is going to most likely be a lot better than if you rush to the finish and don't get the info you need and make snap decisions.
[33:13] Erin Birt: Great advice. I love it. And I just want to thank you so much for being here and for sharing your experience and your personal journey and how that has influenced you to transform the traditional divorce routes into a process that is much better for your clients and for those that are listening today. So I just want to remind everybody listening today this is Brenda Bridges with Bridging Divorce Solutions out of Chattanooga, Tennessee. But she handles cases or helps clients beyond Tennessee and virtually as well. And so thanks for listening.
[33:49] Brenda Bridges: Thank you so much for having me and I really appreciate everything you do.
[33:53] Erin Birt: Thank you, Brenda.
Work with Us for a Better Divorce Experience
[34:05] Erin Birt: And that's a wrap for today's episode of Restorative Divorce. We hope you found the insight shared here valuable and empowering. Remember, divorce and co-parenting may present challenges, but they also offer opportunities for personal growth and positive change. By embracing a positive approach, we can transform conflict into cooperation and pain into healing. If you have any questions, comments or topics you'd like us to explore in future episodes, don't hesitate to reach out. Your feedback is invaluable to us. If you're facing divorce or need guidance, reach out to us at Restorative Divorce. Our team, including experts like Brenda Bridges, is here to support you through every step of your journey. Prioritize self-care, nurture your relationships, and approach every challenge with courage and compassion. Thank you for tuning in to restorative divorce. Take care and we'll catch you on the next episode.
